Saturday, February 16, 2008

John McCain & Bush Approve of the Use of Torture

John McCain's Tortured Logic And Flip Flop On Torture
Keith Olbermann with Rachel Maddow
Politics trumps principles and Moral Values or Ethics

see video below at end of this post of abuse, torture ,and inhumane and humiliating treatment of detainees at Abu Ghraib. And these are the so-called Christian good guys.

Bush still claims techniques such as Waterboarding are not forms of torture as he is quoted in this article in the Guardian:
Bush references London attacks to defend waterboarding, Ewen MacAskill in Washington,, February 15 2008

...But his most controversial remarks were over waterboarding. He told the BBC's Matt Frei: "To the critics, I ask them this: when we, within the law, interrogate and get information that protects ourselves and possibly others in other nations to prevent attacks, which attack would they have hoped that we wouldn't have prevented?

"And so, the United States will act within the law. We'll make sure professionals have the tools necessary to do their job within the law."

and : the BBC interview, Bush was asked whether, given waterboarding and other human rights abuses, he could claim the US still occupied the moral high ground. Bush said: "Absolutely." He added: "We believe in human rights and human dignity. We believe in the human condition. We believe in freedom. And we're willing to take the lead. We're willing to ask nations to do hard things. We're willing to accept responsibilities. And - yeah, no question in my mind, it's a nation that's a force for good.

"And history will judge the decisions made during this period of time as necessary decisions."

On Guantanamo Bay, where the US has been holding hundreds for years without trial, he would "like it to be empty" but he was "comfortable with recognizing this is still a dangerous world". He said: "There's some people there that need to be tried. And there will be a trial. And they'll have their day in court. Unlike what they did to other people.

"Now, there's great concern about, you know, and I can understand this, that these people be given rights. They're not willing to grant the same rights to others. They'll murder. But, you gotta understand, they're getting rights. And I'm comfortable with the decisions we've made."

If waterboarding is not torture then what does Bush or his handlers deem to be a technique which could be called torture. His answer to this has shifted many times . But in the end he believes he is the one who decides since he is the President and the Commander in Chief. So whatever he decides is therefore given his mandate is therefore by definition legal. Bush's notion of legal is purely a matter of defining words in a particular way and then either putting those terms within the context of legislation or just creating a signing statement which over-rides an existing law . Bush also believes he can make something legal retroactively. By doing so he can cover his own ass as well as anyone else in his administration or connected with it in some substantial manner.

What is disturbing about Bush and his group of friends is that they talk about representing the moral high ground when in fact they are constantly finding new ways to justify their actions through various rationalizations and then hidden behind some form of legaleeze and parsing their statements. . Bush and co. can not for one second admit to having done wrong either morally, ethically or legally. Cheney and Rumsfeld and the Neocons have taught bush well.

Bush believes that because Terrorists are willing to commit murder and kill innocent civilians then they should not be granted the same rights as other prisoners. If so then one could then claim that anyone who murders innocent people should not be guaranteed their legal rights . So anyone in the United States arrested and accused of murder should be denied their legal rights. Of course the Neocons and large numbers of Americans would in fact agree with such a position in regard to murderers arrested inside the United States . The presumption of innocence they as a foolish and weak and ineffective response to such criminals.So why torture anyone convicted or accused of a crime in the United States.

These are the same sort of people who would have found ways to justify hunting down Christian Heretics, or Pagans or Witches . The various Inquisitions and tribunals and such which hunted down Heretics and Witches often claimed they were doing GOd's Work and could not be criticized for their actions. In deed it would seem as history shows us those who led these hunts for heretics and witches believed that those who criticized them were themselves heretics or were possessed by demonic forces. Bush and the Neocons judge any who question their ideology and their agenda and tactics not merely as having a different view but of being demonic or in common parlance UnAmerican, anti-American , subversives , radicals , anti-Christian and therefore on the side of the enemy i.e. the Terrorists. Once again we find ourselves in this Manichean world view in which there are no shades of grey or nuances in which there is only good v evil and Bush and Co. are on the side of good.

And from Information Clearing House we see how the slippery-slope of abuses and torture of "Detainees" by US forces and CIA at Guantanamo, Abu Ghraib and other US prisons is becoming the way of all police forces in the United States. Of course those who are obsessed with " Law and Order " at any cost will find ways to justify such abuses as in the cases of the overuse of the Tazer.

Guantanamo Comes to Main Street U.S.A.By Mark A. Goldman

12/02/08 "ICH" -- -- They say that the difference between how democracy in Europe has evolved compared to that of the United States is that in Europe the government is afraid of the People whereas in the United States the People are afraid of the government. That's a dangerous state of affairs and it looks like it's going to get worse.

It's not only a matter of who you vote for... it's a matter of how well informed you are when you do vote... and Americans now are notorious for not being nearly as well informed as the citizens of many other countries are. So in America, we don't really think that deeply about the range of choices that are or are not available to us. Fatal mistake.

The video below is indicative of the evolving consciousness of law enforcement in our nation... and it's our 'Shock and Awe' government, with its penchant for gratuitous and unconscionable violence, and the People's refusal to hold them accountable, that is setting the stage for our future in this 'land of the free and home of the brave.'

When we allow fear and force to dominate the way in which our government deals with people we don't know... we open the door to despotism, for surely when we fail to protect the legitimate rights of any group or person, we sow the seeds of our own destruction. Take a look at this video if you want to know what is happening to civil liberties in our own country. I guess for some members of our community, this is not news at all.

Apparently local law enforcement officers are now being trained to treat citizens the way military personnel were trained to treat Guantanamo prisoners. Your government doesn't seem to care anymore what you think... except maybe during an election year and even then, not so much. And like the military, many police officers who have been trained to just follow orders, are doing just that...just following orders. Watch this video.

Everything by the book

and in case you missed it here is a rather graphic video of Abu Ghraib Iraq where it is well documented that torture and abuse took place. And what is more disturbing is that torture and abuse of detainees is still going on in various US run prisons.
Will Obama or Hillary insists on prosecuting all those involve even high ranking officers and officials at the Pentagon or the White House and right up to Cheney, Rimsfeld, Condoleeza Rice, Gonzales & Bush .

Will we never see justice done in these cases or are the American people in agreement believing Americans can do whatever they want while expecting everybody else to maintain a higher standard human decency and rights .
scenes of torture nudity
all of these actions depicted in this video are forms of torture, abuse and inhumane treatment and constitute crimes.

And What Would Jesus Do ? According to Bush / Cheney and the American Religious Right Jesus would do the same as these soldiers showing no mercy for these " Demonic enemies of Christianity and God ". The propaganda that Bush /Cheney and the mass media feed us is that either these are just " a few bad apples " or that these abuses are necessary when dealing with such evil individuals. And it doesn't matter if they are guilty in the strict sense or not. Being Muslims they are seen by Americans as being anti-American and anti-Christianity and are therefore guilty.

The disturbing thing about all of these abuses is the silence on the part of Christian Institutions and Churches and so-called Christians. But Christians have little or no tolerance for other religions . Their hatred of Muslims goes back to at least the First Crusade in 1097 and therefore is almost as old as their hatred of Jews which goes back to a few years after the death of Christ.

and so it goes,

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